'Not as Nice as You Think.' Did Ellen's Fall Begin with Her 2018 NYTimes Interview?

With her talk show taking a plunge in ratings and her celebrity friends seemingly silent in support, Ellen DeGeneres fall from public grace is accelerating. She may be getting support from Jay Leno, Diane Keaton, Kevin Hart, Katy Perry, her wife and her older brother but she is also being slammed by former staffers that are coming forward with a willingness to go public.

What may be the first indication that her brand is being negatively impact by the reports is her rating's dive. "'Ellen' reruns drew a 1.0 Live + Same Day household rating in the week ended July 26, 2020, according to Nielsen. That was down 9% from the prior week and a glaring -29% from the same week last summer," reports The Wrap.

While her troubles have galvanized online tabloids, the Washington Post published a detailed account of her fall from the public grace. (Note: the story is behind a firewall.) In it they suggest it may have started with an interview with the New York Times in December, 2018 with the now prescient headline: "Ellen DeGeneres Is Not as Nice as You Think."

In this rare, lengthy interview (conducted by Jason Zinoman) , the comedian was promoting her Netflix special "Relatable." On the special, DeGeneres hoped to present a more authentic version of herself than the one on her talk show, one more abrasive with hints of not being "nice."

"In sharp contrast to her public image as everyone's good friend, happy to listen, she presents herself – with tongue in cheek – as cartoonishly aloof and indifferent, stuck in a privileged bubble, cracking several jokes, for instance, about her fabulous wealth," the newspaper writes, adding that in 2018 she made $87.5 million that year, making her one of the top 15 highest paid celebrities in the world.

In her stand-up DeGeneres told the Times: "I wanted to show all of me," she said. "The talk show is me, but I'm also playing a character of a talk-show host. There's a tiny, tiny bit of difference." And she described her show as "escapism for what's going on, one hour of feeling good. At the core it's a comedy show. But if it's not funny, at least it feels good."

DeGeneres said her wife also had a note about this interview.

"Portia said: 'Just remember, the nicer they are, the more they are going to screw you,'" DeGeneres said.

Zinoman then placed himself in the interview: "Unsure how to respond, I replied awkwardly: "That's good advice." Then I started feeling self-conscious and several minutes later, asked my least-nice question, about the tabloid stories featuring anonymous complaints that she isn't always kind to those she works with. "That bugs me if someone is saying that because it's an outright lie," she said. "The first day I said: 'The one thing I want is everyone here to be happy and proud of where they work, and if not, don't work here.' No one is going to raise their voice or not be grateful. That's the rule to this day."

A number of the comments to the story the Times published in a side bar questioned her sincerity, foreshadowing her current career crisis. One reader, Mary Ann from Santa Monica wrote: "I've heard stories about Ellen's mean streak for years now, and this is a smart way for her to put that into a context that allows for understanding and acceptance. It reminds me of the theme of Jim Carrey's new show, Kidding, which shows the darkness in life's challenges."

While another, Joanne from New Zealand questioned DeGeneres's commitment to lesbian causes: "After she had the big coming out, she went post-gay and seemed to disassociate herself from any connection to the L community, preferring the company of already famous people. Giving her money to animals, rather than financially strapped Lesbian causes, or tv/film projects that almost never get off the ground due to funding. I wish she had used more of that weekly platform to promote celesbian talent and give a nod to 'The L Word' just once (it ran for six seasons). Everyone talks about Ellen's kindness, but I mostly find the show awkward to watch (especially her uncomfortable interview style)."